Kentucky Considers Closing Betting at Post Time

From Daily Racing Form comes this:

Kentucky to weigh earlier bet closing
By Matt Hegarty
LEXINGTON, Ky. - Kentucky regulators will consider next Tuesday whether betting on races held in the state should be closed at zero minutes to post regardless of whether all the horses have been loaded into the gate, officials for the Kentucky Horse Racing Commission said on Monday.

The change would reduce the instances in which the odds on horses drop during the opening moments of a race, according to Lisa Underwood, the executive director of the commission. Bettors consistently grumble that odds changes while a race is being run create the impression that other bettors are able to wager after the gates open, even though officials of racetracks and bet-processing companies contend that past-posting incidents are extremely rare.

The proposal was recommended by the racing commission's Wagering Integrity Committee, which met on Monday morning at the commission's offices outside of Lexington.

The committee also recommended that the racing commission consider a proposal to make any facility in Kentucky that accepts a wager liable to pay off the bet even if the bet is not transmitted into the pools, Underwood said. That proposal will also be considered at the Oct. 28 meeting, according to Underwood.

Late odds changes affect countless horse races every year because of the vast influx of money in the last minute before a race going off and the inability of the bet-processing network to recalculate and transmit new odds instantaneously for each bet that enters the system, according to racing officials. Delays to the updates also occur because display systems such as monitors and tote boards do not instantaneously receive the updated odds. By closing the pools earlier, many of those delays may be halted so that no horse's odds change during the running of the race, according to supporters of the proposal.

Late odds changes have also occurred when the bet-processing system continues to accept bets after a race has started. One member of the racing commission's Wagering Integrity Committee, the high-rolling Lexington handicapper Mike Maloney, has documented at least one instance of the betting pools remaining open when he made bets on a race at Fair Grounds in New Orleans in 2007 for almost one minute after the gates opened.

Thanks Barry, very interesting, not sure if you seen my post re: my visit to the tote? but would appear the concern is not unique.
Must also say the activity at the "death" (one or two minutes before the off) is a bit frantic!

I would suggest we all get into the habit that NO cancelled bets 10 mins before the official off time and NO bets taken 2 mins before the off time, to ensure all co mingled bets etc, are logged and frozen before the official off time.

Punters are creatures of Habit and some like placing late bets,posted before that the windows/betting should be closed when first Horse is loaded.

U really think Phumulela would want to lose that extra bit of cash at the off?!

I cannot stand punters who punt at the death. You could be standing in the que waiting to place your bet for later races and some bloke will barge to the front and place his bet on the race which has just gone off. The clerks should not accept these bets. The off time should be the cut off time. A dirty trick that some play is this. THey take a double or a treble. Two football sides that they know will win and the 3rd in their treble is a dog race that will be going off next. He places the bet just as the dogs go. He then fiddles around in his pocket making as if he is looking for the money to pay for the bet. When he sees that the dog in his bet will not win, you can judge after 100 yards if your dog has any chance, he legs it out of the bookies or he says please cancel as I have left my wallet at home.

They might end up with more if the punters had confidence in the system, maybe you guys are correct, but the cancelled ticket could be considered?

Sasky: you hit the nail on the head pal.

Here, in the good old U. S. of A., we have a little thing known as the "Caliente Shuffle," in which horses in Southern California that appear to be headed to the starting gates, instead are kept walking right past the Iron Monster, in the general direction of Mexico, where Agua Caliente racetrack used to run races. The joke is that somebody would say "Hey, where are those horses going"? And somebody once said "They are going to Caliente!"

In reality, like every North American racing jurisdiction except the New York Racing Association, post time is a mere suggestion of what time a race should commence. Post time acts as sort of a guide as to when punters can plan on getting in their final bets.

At Santa Anita, in the real old days, the track owner was perched high atop the grandstand in a private cupola, and he had a switch that he would activate when he figured enough money had been squeezed out of the public. Doc Charles H. Strub would use his onw eyeballs and get reports from the mutuel manager as to how long the betting lines were. When the time seemed right, the switch would be flipped and all of a sudden, instead of heading to Caliente, the horses would make a U turn and go into the gate.

Time elapsed between post time and starting time in North America is about 2 to 3 minutes, sometimes 4 in extreme cases.

In New York, when it says post time, the races are run. They are the only legitimate post time keepers in our country.

Tote betting is all about maximization of wagering and the churn. You gots to have dat churn, baby! If you don't believe me, ask your stock broker!!!

I second the idea of a cut off time. There will be obvious losses in the begining but punters will soon adjust quickly. I have seen time and time again how punters in the tote who dont get on simply punt the next race, whether it be the Summer Cup or a race in Towoomba.

As long as the race hasn't started I can't see what the problem of having a bet just before the gates open.

The problem isn't the punters, software or tote. Its the unprofessional and mind numbing loading process that takes place here.

Many years ago some absolute fool in South Africa decreed it would be a good idea for the horses to wonder around in circles behind the gates for 10 minutes before a race. No wonder no race ever goes off on time here.

To my mind its pretty simple, load the field quickly when the all the horses get to the gates and viola, problem solved.

If all bets were stopped at the scheduled off time PE would not generate any pool money!!!

there is a reason why these guys are doing this.
we will do the same.
KING III report.
IT security.
Auditors will insist that we do it, else they will not give the company a clean balance sheet..hence the share price will fall..because the pension fund managers will have to sell the blocks of shares they bought in the company..their mandate allows only the purchase of shares in companies will clean balance sheets..

as much as we tour the tote premises..as much as they give assurances that it cannot happen..the reality....
THE AUDITORS agree with me...print the DATABASE LOG TAPE..from race post time till clear is given and dividents are posted....there should be no transactions during that period on the DATABASE LOG TAPE..then they will sign the balance sheets...

until then..take it as a fact..someone is scheming the tote..here,,, usa..all over..