Tips for using Betfair?

  • Superbet
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Tips for using Betfair?

16 years 1 month ago
#59195
I have been using Betfair casually since about 2005. I don't regard myself as a large punter at all, and make most of my large bets locally. In fact, I mostly use Betfair to get a feel of the market, see where the big money is going etc. I've also been wary of the legalities... particularly recently where there appears to be a clamp down from either SARS, or DTI, or the Reserve Bank (not entirely sure who has authority).

Anyway, I've been relatively successful on Betfair over the years, particularly being able to trade myself into "all green" positions on sporting events. Every few weeks, or months, I withdraw a few hundred dollars. My buggest withdrawal has probably been a thousand dollars. I use an FNB Visa card, and have never experienced problems with payments being made.

Anyway, I'm at the point where I'd like to take Betfair a bit more seriously, and start betting with larger amounts. I've assumed that the reason I've never had any problems is that the amounts were relatively small.

It may still be small fry for some, but the amounts I'm looking at now is probably depositing about R10k ZAR per month into Betfair, trading with it, and withdrawing whatever profits - if there are any! - at least once monthly.

My questions:

1. Will these amounts attract any attention?
2. Is this legal? (if not, why has it gone unnoticed for the past 4 years)
3. Is there any tips or tricks that SA'ns are using when trading on Betfair in terms of depositing and withdrawing funds?
4. Lastly, anyone have any inside info on Betfair having a fully functional SA presence?

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  • Superbet
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Re: Re: Tips for using Betfair?

16 years 1 month ago
#59196
You mean open up a UK bank account?

How easy is that to do? Can I do it remotely from SA?

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  • Jamster
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Re: Re: Tips for using Betfair?

16 years 1 month ago
#59203
bait. . .

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  • Garrick
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Re: Re: Tips for using Betfair?

16 years 1 month ago
#59205
Superbet - You didn't say where you lived or whether you are a SA citizen. Both of these issues are relevant. For the purposes of this email I am assuming you are a SA citizen living in RSA.

Firstly - With regard to using your credit card it is quite simple. You are allowed transactions of up to R20,000 ( when last I checked ) on your card- ostensibly to allow you to purchase off sites such as Amazon etc., - without attracting undue scrutiny. Although punting on Betfair is 'illegal' this is probably why you have been 'getting away with it'. ( I remain convinced that those who have fallen foul of the law using this method are more likely to have been those who 'fell in' and could not settle their cards ).

Nevertheless - As a SA citizen ( and PROVIDED you are in good standing with SARS [ie your taxes are up to date] ) you are permitted to apply for a directive to take R2 million per taxpayer offshore ( once off ) to invest as you wish.

As stated in another email I see no reason why you should not thereafter open an offshore bank account and feed money from that account into your Betfair account to your heart's content.

There may be technical reasons why I am wrong but nobody has yet disputed this option although Saftote would make B-I-G eyes and threaten all sorts of dire repercussions for even thinking this way!

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  • whitehouse
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Re: Re: Tips for using Betfair?

16 years 1 month ago
#59207
Be very careful,do it properly because if you do not get proper authority from the reserve bank and one of you are reported to the reserve bank be prepared to pay a hefty fine.Two prominent bookmakers who shall remain nameless each paid fines in the last year or so of R250,000 each for trading on betfair without the right authority so all those punters who abuse others on the forum BE WARNED.Gold Circle and Phumelela dont want them here as they do not contribute much to the stake pool so rather use interbet if you are concerned about the future of South African Racing

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  • Superbet
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Re: Re: Tips for using Betfair?

16 years 1 month ago
#59211
Thanks for the info Garrick.

Yep, I am an SA citizen, and from what I understand, a tax-payer in good standing. The off-shore bank a/c sounds like a good option. Just need to find out the technicalities of making it work.

I actually went to go and check the forex regulations - it does mention the R20k limit per transaction for foreign purchases. It also specifically outlaws such purchases for international lottery purchases... but makes no specific mention of sportsbetting.

Copying and pasting some of the regulations below:

(D) Miscellaneous payments for imports, services or subscriptions by means of credit and/or debit cards
Individual cardholders in whose name one or more bank credit and/or debit cards have been issued, may be permitted to make permissible foreign exchange payments for small transactions in their personal name, e.g. imports over the Internet, by means of such credit and/or debit cards. Payments are limited to R20 000 per transaction. NB: This dispensation does not absolve cardholders from ad valorem excise and custom duties or from complying with the requirements imposed by Customs, a division of SARS.

(E) Foreign lottery tickets
Residents may not participate by using the credit card in lotteries organised abroad, as such participation contravenes the Lotteries Act, 1997 (Act No. 57 of 1997), the National Gambling Act, 2004 (Act No. 7 of 2004) and the Regulations. Accordingly, Authorised Dealers will decline requests to purchase foreign exchange for such purposes in all instances. In addition, all issuers of credit cards may not accept debits against resident cardholders' accounts for the payment of foreign lottery tickets so purchased.

These are available at - www.fnb.co.za/personal/transact/easybanking/credit.html

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  • rob faux
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Re: Re: Tips for using Betfair?

16 years 1 month ago
#59212
There are 2 issues here,beinga) the legality of transacting on Betfair and b)the funding thereof.
Part b) is exactly as per AB & Garrick's advice.

Insofar as a) is concerned,nobody (including a couple of attorneys I have spoken to) seems to be sure.

I think the clue might be RULE 72.4 of the NHA rules which reads:
72.4.1 An OWNER,TRAINER,STABLE EMPLOYEEor their respective SPOUSES shall not,directlyor indirectly,place a bet with a Betting Exchange in respect of a HORSE owned,trained or cared for by such OWNER,TRAINER and/or STABLE EMPLOYEE other than that such HORSE will win the race in which it is to participate.

I assume this rule should be unnecessary if using Exchanges was illegal per se'

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  • greenbook
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Re: Re: Tips for using Betfair?

16 years 1 month ago
#59278
whitehouse, the stakes contribution is a red herring. P and GC are well capable of negotiating a decent stakes deal from anyone, betfair included. and betfair will more than pay its way as it does everywhere else. the truth is they don't want betfair because they're afraid they might be taught a lesson in how to market and promote the game.

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  • Dave Scott
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Re: Re: Tips for using Betfair?

16 years 1 month ago
#59285
Interesting debate gents, however Betfair is illegal in S.A. and to encourage debate is not viewed lightly by SA regulators.

We have received communication to this effect.

We have no choice but to close this thread to further debate.

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