Calling Louis G -sales 2012

Louis, out of interest do you attend all the various yearling sales around the country? What sales do you perceive to offer the best value? I always believed that any sale after the National's was worth looking at, but with the new Cape Sale I think that will change. Will you be at the Cape Sale and what do think the market will be like in 2012?

Any other breeding experts please share your views.Jack Dash etc.

There is value at every sale....just got to know what to look for.... big shift from the Cape that used to be stealing before the big hype
Nationals next year should be interesting now that the Cape has totally upped their game....but the best are these Mike Holmes jobs
where big tagged horses are reposessed and sell for 2-3 months stable keep....:S

Muhtiman Wrote:

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> There is value at every sale....just got to know
> what to look for.... big shift from the Cape
> that used to be stealing before the big hype
> Nationals next year should be interesting now that
> the Cape has totally upped their game....but the
> best are these Mike Holmes jobs
> where big tagged horses are reposessed and sell
> for 2-3 months stable keep....:S


Agreed - especially as the 'big guns' are not normally present as buyers at the low-key 'Mike Holmes jobs' (well there is the buy-backs of course, but that's another story) - you just need to know what you're doing (ask Clint Binda, I suppose) or have somebdoy in your camp who knows what he/she is doing ...(tu)

Frodo can u explain to the novices readng this what a 'buy back' is and its purpose.Thnx

Well lots of others could probably explain it better, but hypothetically speaking, it could happen that a seller offers a horse for sale and has a certain price in mind - but he does not want to declare a reserve because commision is calculated on the reserve and not the selling price - somebody then bids on behalf of the seller to 'chase' the price, but if there are no other genuine buyers, the horse gets knocked back to the seller - this is known as a buy-back and is reflected in the sales figures as 'sold', but for all practical purposes it has in fact not been sold.

I'm sure there are a few threads on the forum on this topic.

Thnx frodo

@ Harris =

I agree with Muhti, overall. Here are my opinions on the Specific Sales for 2012, as per your question.

First, some general notes:-

1)Racing is evolving all the time. What was the norm 3 years ago has already changed completely.

2)For instance, the Ready to Run Sale is a niche Sale, simply because of two factors, being that you can observe a horse's galloping action before the Sale and because only the horses from the Sale are eligible for the Emperors R2R Cup race for R2M Stakes. (R2,5M next year !).

3)There are only so many horses in SA and then, obviously only so many "superior" horses in terms of breeding in SA. So, when you have the old Regional Cape Sale replaced by a Premier Sale and another Sale in the Cape, the ethos is upset. There will not be that many "superior" bred horses left for National One, up here.

4)Last year already, we saw some very poorly conformed individuals on offer at National One. This would never have been the case, say 8 or 10 years ago. Those horses would have failed National One and would have gone to a Regional Sale, as National Two was for the late maturers. At "National" Sales, conformation was very important.

5)Everyone jumped on the bandwagon 3 or 4 years ago and bred with almost any mare, due to the Economic Boom. We have had an excess of horses, due to the time factor. It takes about 3 years to get a horse through the ring. Say, book/pay for Stallion Service 6 months before, 1 year Gestation, 1 year to become a yearling, 6 months to Sale. (roughly rounded)

6)Last year's National 2 YO Sale had some really scary individuals on offer. Why ? too many horses.

7)But, Breeders have learnt. Many mares are now retired/not breeding. So, last year's example will change again in 2012 and again in 2013.

My opinions on the various Sales :-

1. Cape Premier Sale a) General - Very high quality horses, definite source of good horses.
b) Opportunities - i) Find value amongst the "non hype" but high quality horses
ii)No.1 opportunity to buy and sell later in year, eg R2R Sale.
c) Concerns - i) Cost of keep is for a long time before Racing.
ii)Horses will be expensive
d) LGRS approach - We are definitely going down. We will find the value from the quality horses down there.

2. Cape Pemier (book 2) a) General - Value Sale, fair to good quality.
b) Opportunities - i) Value
ii) Good opportunity to buy early types.
iii) 2nd best opportunity to buy for resale through R2R.
c) Concerns - The Sale will have some of the poorer type specimens
- Prices may be false, as they try and ride on the back of the Premier Sale.
d) LGRS approach - We will be there. Value horses only.

3. National One a) General - Good Sale, but overall quality will be a mixed batch of good and average.
b) Opportunities - There will be plenty.
c) Concerns - The Sale is no longer the No.1 Quality Sale.
- It is sort of in "no mans land" in that the 2 Cape Sales are the "early" ones and the R2R
Sale is now the Premium "late" Sale.
d) LGRS approach - We will look for extreme value only. The lower priced sorts, that pass our conformational
Test rather than being just the "best bred" sorts.

4) Natal Winter Sale - We skip this one, unless an Owner requests.

5) National Two a) General - Value, not so much quality.
b) Opportunities - inexpensive horses
c) Concerns - A lot of the "leftovers" on the Sale.
d) LGRS approach - We will buy with the same approach as with National One.

6) Ready to Run a) General - overall good spread of horses.
b) Opportunities - observe the horse's action
- R2R Cup as the goal
- value
- payment terms.
- horse is already under saddle - straight into full Training.
c) Concerns - many "buy backs"
- many "spec" horses
d) LGRS approach - A very happy hunting ground for us. We have designed a system that works for us.

As for the Cape Premier Sale, we have excellent accomm available, 400m from the Convention Centre, flight info/deals and a Vito Bus for the week as well as 10 seats at the Met. We will be there for the whole week.....

I've sold some horses over the years, probably about 60 or so on auction. Obviously in the beginning we were complete novices but after a while you know what's what.

What really surprised me was that the best buyers (by which I mean people who bought well both economically and ability on average) tended to be open and would engage you as a seller. The opposite also proved to be the case.

As a seller, I don't think you know any more than anyone else about the ability of what you are selling. Certainly, you are familiar with the individual and you may be aware of faults because you have been there to see them over a long period. I can say some of the most unsuspecting people are brilliant judges, which I could tell because I would watch them fault very accurately my whole string in minutes and find almost everything.

The funniest behaviour are the buyers who walk around like cat burglars thinking that the whole show is rigged, you can spot them walking in from the car park. It is true that every seller who has something special knows it, and so do the buyers who go for them, and then it is game on. But for the rest it is like life, some skill and tons of luck. The truth of the matter is we have all had champions walk right past us as we looked for them...and seen zip.