Fractional ownership( syndicate)

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6 months 3 weeks ago #738575 by Bob Brogan
Bob Brogan created the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
I think this is a great idea from Normandy Stud ( not been asked to post this)

A chance to have six in the Snaith yard from as little as R2667 for a 1% share.

Guide
10% would cost R26 670
100% Would Cost R266 700

Would imagine keep would start at around R10000 x 6 so roughly R600 per 1% per month ( an estimate before extras)

From Normandy Stud’s twitter

These are the four colts in our first fractional ownership syndicate of the 2018 2yo crop. All to be trained by @SnaithRacing. Just R2667 per 1%, and you get same share of 2 fillies' racing careers for free. Is there another Sergeant Hardy here?
Come racing with us!

Colts



Fillies



There’s quite a few opportunities out there now

Onamission ( Matt de Kock)
Green street
Might even start ABC syndicate again( never had a loser )

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6 months 3 weeks ago #738579 by Dave Scott
Dave Scott replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
Good idea to get an interest in the game
The most successful formula to get new blood racing is to have an actual interest in a horse

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6 months 3 weeks ago #738584 by Muhtiman
Muhtiman replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
....a sign of the times the overflow of too much product ......current buying pool over saturated but the only way to go is to try broaden the base and get fresh participation...... however horse syndication can be dicey, I'm sure that it starts off well with a bunch of fun loving racing guys out for a jol....what if it's another PJ....going for the triple crown and an offer of a few bar is made, some want to stay others no way we want to take money and run....or we all in with the trainer with a 10-20% share and he tells the jock to beat the draw in a top race....it is tempting but already you are insisting on geographic criteria that may not suit others....or like that saga with our very own 20/1 who got into partial ownership in total no hopers .....here you are locked into a trainer and horses that may not live up to the criteria of the other stable stars.....or some of the other syndication's around where it seems that the management are the only winners while the other partners are getting something with a win or 3.....but are still on a hiding second to none....these syndicates are not yet shopping in the upper end of the market for syndicate members.....we see their triumphs advertised yet what of all the other also rans and horses that never made it to the track or were retired from racing after a few runs.....don't want to be too negative about getting people re/ involved in syndication..... but this new management system EquineHub can be a better vehicle for partial ownership and for newer ownership participants and established owners to test the waters the system can also be incorporated into current syndication management....or develop new syndicates.....had a chat with a trainer that once had a fairly successful syndication only for it to be hi jacked by the very people that helped him put it together.....he has been very active at recent sales and I hope that he is going Equine Hub route to give him the necessary protection to grow syndication....:unsure:

My idea of "help from above" is a sniper on the roof
and a higher power is a hell fire missile armed drone.

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6 months 3 weeks ago #738585 by Bob Brogan
Bob Brogan replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
I`m sorry Muhit, fractional syndication has been a big part of racing world wide fro decades and very succesful indeed.

It`s a great way to get involved, feel apart of it.. Remember we`re talking about fun here

A few grand to have an interest.

The only reason Syndicates were frowned on by South African stables is the fact they take a bit of running...

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6 months 3 weeks ago #738586 by Muhtiman
Muhtiman replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)

Bob Brogan wrote: I`m sorry Muhit, fractional syndication has been a big part of racing world wide fro decades and very succesful indeed.

It`s a great way to get involved, feel apart of it.. Remember we`re talking about fun here

A few grand to have an interest.

The only reason Syndicates were frowned on by South African stables is the fact they take a bit of running...


.....yes I am aware of the big international syndicates and very successful I think Motivator was owned by a 1000 members.....I know a share in a horse is a great way to go.....have plugged on here for a local syndicate however there are also the downside that needs to be advised upfront.....I believe that the EquineHub system will address many of the pitfalls into partial or syndication ownership especially here where registration and the like can be tedious....:dry:

My idea of "help from above" is a sniper on the roof
and a higher power is a hell fire missile armed drone.

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6 months 3 weeks ago #738601 by Frodo
Frodo replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
I agree with Muhti - it is not for everyone; by all means if you would like to get 'involved' and don't care too much whether the horse is based in Kimberley or Cape Town and you are happy to leave the 'planning' to a nominee - then by all means go for it.

For me personally I'd rather get together with 3 or 4 'connections' and have a bigger say in where the horse is based and input on the horse's career - yes more expensive, but I'd rather get involved in one horse with a few connections (more control), than 5 horses with many connections (no control)

But to each his own ....

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6 months 3 weeks ago #738602 by Muhtiman
Muhtiman replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
..............they beauty of system concept like EquineHub is you can either spread your leisure/hobby investment across a portfolio of multiple "stocks" with many different trainers or parole into a single product/stock sniper style.....Frodo at one time you and I both fancied a horse that was bought by a syndication.....you or Elvis inquired....nothing to offer as it was snapped up.....that horse raced twice....dismal runs then no more.....could have died....maybe a pet ....or even at stud....no one but the syndicate nominee/manager and maybe trainer will know....now with transparency to use a concept whereby any participant will know the ins and outs of all products in the system it will be known who has the goodies and who did not....:huh:

My idea of "help from above" is a sniper on the roof
and a higher power is a hell fire missile armed drone.

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6 months 3 weeks ago - 6 months 3 weeks ago #738614 by Garrick
Garrick replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
Is there any difference between forming a syndicate to own a racehorse or forming a syndicate to play the lottery?

In both instances you are getting involved in a financial venture where you have little or no prospect of showing a return or, at least, covering your outlay.

Fractional participation tends to be aimed at people who cannot afford sole ownership. Sorry, guys, but those individuals should stay well away because they are usually uninformed in every sense of the term and will quickly lose interest or become disenchanted. They end up becoming 'owner fodder' and are usually quick to recount their negative experiences at every opportunity.

Promoters of the concept will always cite other 'advantages' of shared or fractional ownership. Unfortunately the social aspect of ownership has withered and largely died so there is not too much to entertain anyone unless being a 'patron' of an activity is something that rings your bell. Some people find 'patronage' attractive and palatable but they are usually characterised by being sufficiently well heeled in the first instance so can afford the indulgence.

The flaw in the whole system is, unfortunately, this :

Up & up goes the price of quality bloodstock, training it etc.
Down and down goes the nett reward for a successful horse if you race locally.

It doesn't take even the most ignorant newbie too long to figure this out! At this point they usually ask themselves why they were stupid enough to get involved and promptly duck.

Another poster made a very good point with regard to the stock : I have yet to see a high priced, immaculately bred and conformed yearling offered. Instead only (at best!) middle to lower end unsold candidates are generally offered. So although luck plays a huge role in your outcome with any racehorse syndicates often start off at a further disadvantage by being involved with stock that seldom or never comprises the top 10% of the market.

My 'feelings' toward a horse have never been influenced by whether I have owned it or not. I still see past champions as 'my' horse in those instances where I was particularly fond of them and profited (correction : did not lose too much backing them) by following them.

I have worn almost every hat in racing and have to admit that the only part which used to (but no longer) gave me the most fun & pleasure was punting. Since I realised that it is an addiction I have managed to scale that back to almost nothing. But it has the priceless advantage that you can stop or suspend activities when you are not in the mood, are having a bad run or are exploring other activities.

One rule which I rather regret breaking was a piece of advice given to me when I was much younger and far too 'clever' to heed :

Never invest in anything that eats while you sleep.

In recent years I have modified that slightly to suit my circumstances :

I wish I had bought fewer horses and more Porsches.

I have owned approximately 60 horses (or parts thereof) and never made a profit on any of them. Conversely I have owned 3 Porsches and never made a loss on any of them. Lol.
Last Edit: 6 months 3 weeks ago by Garrick.

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6 months 3 weeks ago #738620 by Muhtiman
Muhtiman replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
.....Garrick your experiences have merit....and there are some of us that need never want to have gotten into ownership at all.....racing needs to present itself to those that have already got Porche's made passive and huge incomes in money markets, internet gaming and other technology driven income streams....I for one have had many fantasy league horses(horses picked at sales) some I have wagered on and did well and some others not.....had a participation system with the ease of getting in and out of "owning' a slice of just a fraction of the fantasy league horses...... I may just have been slightly in the black....... but having far more fun than not doing so.....;)

.....as for horses offered in syndicates and partnerships....they are hardly from the top drawer.....but one can also find that there can be some cheapies or unfashionable sorts that are passed over by the so called experts and find themselves available to a few lucky or even a clever sod that is able to identify a possible diamond in the rough....:blink:

My idea of "help from above" is a sniper on the roof
and a higher power is a hell fire missile armed drone.

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6 months 3 weeks ago #738631 by Frodo
Frodo replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
Garrick's post made me think back to when I started - must be 16 years or so - been involved in around 20 (?) horses - can honestly remember only 3 or 4 that have not won a race - many pleasurable moments - the bug has not left me alone yet B)

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6 months 3 weeks ago #738647 by Magi
Magi replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
I have a seriously decent idea around this concept ..... Bob, you have a contact I can approach at Normandy... contact details?

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6 months 3 weeks ago #738649 by Muhtiman
Muhtiman replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
....read an online story a few weeks back while trying to find info on the Arlington million..... about a what seemed to be a non racing newbie that took a 5% share in Team Valor's Animal Kingdom....which Barry was instrumental in breeding and then put on auction sale...... but then bought back to race with Team Valor for $100 000.... I think his share was $5K.....got the ride of his life in winning the Kentucky Derby....not sure what he was paid out when AK was sold before the Dubai World Cup with Team Valor retaining 25%....:huh: ...one has got to get into partnerships with people that have an impeccable record of getting the goods....;)

My idea of "help from above" is a sniper on the roof
and a higher power is a hell fire missile armed drone.

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2 weeks 3 days ago #753981 by Bob Brogan
Bob Brogan replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
Agree with Oscar, if it`s 1% or 30% the feeling when they win is the same... In fact if it`s not , you probably better not owning them


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2 weeks 3 days ago #753992 by Dave Scott
Dave Scott replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
I was to edit not quote

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2 weeks 3 days ago #753993 by Dave Scott
Dave Scott replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
Ok let me start again
I am fully behind syndicate approach as one thing for sure if you have an interest in a horse you WILL go racing and a winner a massive thrill
We have always tried to make 10% a reasonable buy is for logistic, admin and communication reasons

Eg can you imagine trying to accommodate 100 in parade ring or a visit to the stables

I have listened to the numbers
1% is R800 per month so 80 grand per month 6 horses at 12k each
Buy in 6 grand so value of horses 600k on average 100k each

Wish you well but just watch the reality of the logistics

Just my input

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2 weeks 3 days ago #753994 by Muhtiman
Muhtiman replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
.....problem here is that one has to take the whole parcel.....already getting poor odds that only one or two of them may cut the mustard.....and they would have to really shine among the hot stuff that Snaith more often gets sent from the really deep pockets......:huh:

My idea of "help from above" is a sniper on the roof
and a higher power is a hell fire missile armed drone.

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2 weeks 2 days ago #754004 by Sylvester
Sylvester replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
every time i see fiona ramsden i wonder if Joey Ramsden has a problem with his eyes.

she is stunning

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2 weeks 2 days ago - 2 weeks 2 days ago #754024 by Felix
Felix replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)

Sylvester wrote: every time i see fiona ramsden i wonder if Joey Ramsden has a problem with his eyes.

she is stunning



Absolutely ,like swopping a Ferrari for a Fiat.
Last Edit: 2 weeks 2 days ago by Felix. Reason: ..

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2 weeks 2 days ago #754025 by Dave Scott
Dave Scott replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
Rather stick to the topic chaps txs

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2 weeks 2 days ago #754030 by Muhtiman
Muhtiman replied the topic: Fractional ownership( syndicate)
.....having had my 50 cents worth on avoiding parcels of several horses....it may be suitable for some that just want a bigger chance of getting a more than decent shot of one or two being more than decent.....I am however in favour of singular products and packaged with training and basic costs up front and hopeful that the Equihub trading platform is able to successfully market and promote these syndication products in fair volumes.....baring in mind that it is up to trainers, breeders and syndicate managers to use this platform/system to market and sell "stock" and get more participation in fractional ownership.....I really like the idea that one will be able to get out of a poor performing product by trading investment as a shorter term loss.....or on the converse take up "shares" in what looks like a lemon with niggles and turn it into better performer by finding a solution.....;)

My idea of "help from above" is a sniper on the roof
and a higher power is a hell fire missile armed drone.

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