:Fears and thoughts in South Africa

  • mr hawaii
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Re: Fears and thoughts in South Africa

2 years 7 months ago
#825453
Many thanks @cnc and @bayern and others for your posts on the topic...

As I have stated, the vaccines certainly assist those in at-risk categories to have less severe symptoms if infected and is a likely must for those persons...they will continue to need assistance in the form of boosters and I most certainly hope there are no longer term effects as those nearest and dearest to me have all been fully vaccinated...

As I have posted earlier in the year, my mother in law, with a good few pre-existing conditions, tested positive and without any vaccine available was ill for a few weeks but has since fully recovered...another cousin, in his 30's, with one pre-exisiting condition and vaccinated, recently passed away after 3 days in hospital...no-one else in my immediate family has tested positive...

So, I don't know what to make of all this and I'm following the science as I know it...at-risk categories must take the vaccines to offer some protection...if not in an at-risk category, take all non-pharmeceutical precautions as were required pre-vaccine...this virus is going to be around for a long time like most other coronaviruses...

So, stay safe and healthy...I will not post on this topic again...will focus on trying to help each other make a few cents every day...

I must say there are so many different viewpoints and conflicting studies(and various anecdotes) and changes in policy around that any rational person will be confused but at some point you just have to do what is right for you and accept the consequences be they good or bad -

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  • Lionel
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Re: Fears and thoughts in South Africa

2 years 7 months ago
#825457
Many thanks @cnc and @bayern and others for your posts on the topic...

As I have stated, the vaccines certainly assist those in at-risk categories to have less severe symptoms if infected and is a likely must for those persons...they will continue to need assistance in the form of boosters and I most certainly hope there are no longer term effects as those nearest and dearest to me have all been fully vaccinated...

As I have posted earlier in the year, my mother in law, with a good few pre-existing conditions, tested positive and without any vaccine available was ill for a few weeks but has since fully recovered...another cousin, in his 30's, with one pre-exisiting condition and vaccinated, recently passed away after 3 days in hospital...no-one else in my immediate family has tested positive...

So, I don't know what to make of all this and I'm following the science as I know it...at-risk categories must take the vaccines to offer some protection...if not in an at-risk category, take all non-pharmeceutical precautions as were required pre-vaccine...this virus is going to be around for a long time like most other coronaviruses...

So, stay safe and healthy...I will not post on this topic again...will focus on trying to help each other make a few cents every day...

I must say there are so many different viewpoints and conflicting studies(and various anecdotes) and changes in policy around that any rational person will be confused but at some point you just have to do what is right for you and accept the consequences be they good or bad -

Exactly, Mr H. Personally, it was a very difficult decision for me to make, because I think that I am pretty much in the low risk category (I hope anyway). But I decided to take the jab anyway, because I have a family to consider, and would not want them to bear the consequences (and it will be them, because I will be dead) of me dying because I did not take the jab. There are some kids out there, that I know of personally, that are facing that reality. If the jab causes some other issues down the road, then I will cross that bridge when I get to it. The fact is that some people are dying of the virus, even those with no underlying issues. The vaccine does help (from all the sources that I read) prevent serious complications if one contracts the virus.

I like a gamble, but not at the expense of my family.

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  • Tigershark
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Re: Fears and thoughts in South Africa

2 years 7 months ago
#825459
I have the same thinking Lionel, I also understand the technology used in the Pfizer vaccine and respect the right of individual choice. The lingering thought though is does anyone's right to choose trump someone else's right to life?

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Re: Fears and thoughts in South Africa

2 years 7 months ago
#825468
I have the same thinking Lionel, I also understand the technology used in the Pfizer vaccine and respect the right of individual choice. The lingering thought though is does anyone's right to choose trump someone else's right to life?

Thank you, Tigershark. My answer to your question is, "No". However, I'm not convinced that a person not taking a vaccine, is affecting anyone's else's right to live. No other vaccine thus far has been mandatory, even though they probably saved a lot of lives.

Disclaimer: I don't trust govenrments, Big Pharma, FDA, W.H.O etc etc...

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  • PeterD
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Re: Fears and thoughts in South Africa

2 years 7 months ago
#825479
The evidence supporting vaccination is now overwhelming. In the USA where the majority of adults have been vaccinated, the hospitals, particularly in the southern states are still full with COVID patients, but more than 98% of those hospitalised or dying are un- vaccinated.
The same pattern elsewhere.
In SA, the medical scheme to which I belong, has reported that all of the COVID deaths and nearly all of the hospitalisation of members in the past 4 months is amongst the un- vaccinated.
With hundreds of millions of vaccinations administered worldwide, the adverse side effects are minimal, while the efficacy is high.
In SA we have passed the 250k number of excess deaths since May 2020.
The life assurance industry has paid out more than R10bn of extra claims in SA alone in that period.
Our tourism, leisure and hospitality industries have been decimated.
If we want to get our economies fully opened, we need people to get vaccinated.
If large numbers of people remain unvaccinated, that vastly increases the risk of new and worse variants developing, continues to put pressure on medical resources, and hinders the opening of key sectors of our economy.

The world wiped out polio decades ago and that was done by vaccination, In SA, ALL school children were compulsory vaccinated against polio and society benefitted.

If you live in a community, you have to acknowledge your responsibility to your community and not just your own personal preferences.

To all those who are hesitant about vaccination, please for the sake of all our futures, face the facts and get it done.
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  • mikesack
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Re: Fears and thoughts in South Africa

2 years 7 months ago
#825490
Israel has some interesting consequences, being the most jabbed country in the world. With the pros there will be cons and an insight into what is going on in that nation...………………………


www.globalresearch.ca/never-has-vaccine-harmed-so-many/5754623

www.globalresearch.ca/science-ethics-reg...-individuals/5754616


The Science and Ethics Regarding Risk Posed by Non-vaccinated Individuals: Position Paper



By David Heller

Global Research, September 01, 2021

America's Frontline Doctors 29 August 2021


Theme: Science and Medicine





84

3 15


104



All Global Research articles can be read in 51 languages by activating the “Translate Website” drop down menu on the top banner of our home page (Desktop version).

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***

The “Israeli Public Emergency Council for the COVID Crisis” has released a position paper detailing what they call flawed assumptions and ethical problems inherent in blaming the unvaccinated for the latest wave of COVID.

The first, and possibly most frequently reported flawed assumption is that unvaccinated people get infected with COVID more than the vaccinated. The document cites data showing that “The rate of vaccinated individuals among individuals with verified COVID cases is close to and even identical to their relative proportion in the population even when sorted by age group, and even though the regulations of the Ministry of Health encourage a large number of tests among the unvaccinated.”

The second false assumption, that the unvaccinated infect others more easily than the vaccinated. Data from the CDC, Public Health England, and other studies demonstrate that once infected, the viral load is similar in both the vaccinated and unvaccinated. Since viral load is the most significant factor in the ability to infect others, both vaccinated and unvaccinated pose a similar risk to pass the virus to others.

The third false assumption is that asymptomatic transmission is common. The paper states “Studies show that the rate of transmission of asymptomatic persons is 20 times lower than that of symptomatic patients (who are tested and isolated anyway, regardless of their vaccination status), so that the likelihood of an asymptomatic healthy person who does not know that they carry the virus to infect another person is significantly lower than 1%”






READ MORE:Medical Information Is Being Suppressed to Cover Up for the False COVID Narrative

The paper also points out that high vaccinated countries such as Iceland are also experiencing a new wave of COVID despite their very high (80% – 90%). “Therefore, unvaccinated persons are not what causes the pandemic to continue, nor do they endanger the vaccinated in that aspect. In fact, it seems that the hope of eradicating COVID by achieving “herd immunity” through vaccination of a high-enough percentage of the population has been proven to be unrealistic.”

Putting the burden on the healthcare system from the unvaccinated into perspective, In Israel, about 3% of the hospital beds are for COVID patients. At the time of writing, about 30% of them were occupied by unvaccinated people.

In concluding the scientific arguments, the paper states:


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“There is no scientific evidence whatsoever supporting the claim that non-vaccinated individuals are risking the public’s health in any way more than vaccinated people” and that “vaccination should be treated as a primary means for providing personal protection against severe illness or death, especially for persons at high risk”

Notwithstanding the lack of scientific basis, politicians, health officials, and many in the media continue to blame the unvaccinated for the latest rise of COVID. This raises a number of ethical issues that the council addressed in their paper.


These attacks on individuals’ choice not to take a medical intervention is a slippery slope. Whether it’s someone who has lung disease and continues to smoke, or a heart attack survivor who refuses to alter their diet, or, not to mention some 80% of people who don’t take the vaccine to prevent the seasonal flu. “The mission of the healthcare system is to serve the public, and it must not exercise any consideration that would restrict individual liberty.”


Health decisions should be made freely, otherwise, there will be a loss of trust between patients and healthcare providers: “Public-health policy is effective only when it is based on education and dialogue. Aggressive discourse might result in the loss of trust of significant sectors of the public, and lead to lowering the rates of other routine vaccinations that are of crucial importance.”


Blaming the unvaccinated could “foster the illusion that vaccination protects against contagion” and can result in vaccinated people thinking they are more secure than they really are.

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In concluding their position, the Council writes “In a democracy, in whose core are human dignity and human rights, there is no room for calls and incitement of this kind. The right of society to protection prevails over the right of the individual to freedom only when there is a real danger (as is done in the case of violent psychotic patients, or in the very different case of prisoners). It is wrong to restrict a person’s liberty due to a remote potential risk”
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“The choice of whether to get vaccinated should remain in the hands of every person, according to their understanding and values. We urge the government to immediately call for an end to the aforementioned aggressive discourse while giving explanations to the public that are scientific and accessible that highlight that individuals who have not yet been vaccinated are not a factor that perpetuates the pandemic and endangers the public.”
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17 August 2021

Is the Surge in Covid-19 Cases Among the Vaccinated Attributable to the Virus or to the Vaccine?
Is the Surge in Covid-19 Cases Among the Vaccinated Attributable to the Virus

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  • mikesack
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Re: Fears and thoughts in South Africa

2 years 7 months ago
#825491
Israel...………..……..most jabbed nation in the world. Follow the form book or ignore?




Never Has a Vaccine Harmed So Many



By Dr. Paul Craig Roberts

Global Research, September 01, 2021


Region: Middle East & North Africa

Theme: Science and Medicine





285

64 55


513



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Visit and follow us on Instagram at @crg_globalresearch.

***

The Israeli People’s Committee Report of Adverse Events Related to the Corona Vaccine, April 2021

This report is from last spring. The adverse effects of the Pfizer Covid Vaccine in Israel at the present time are much worse.

Summary:

As of January-February 2021 the vaccination program coincides with a 22% increase in overall mortality, making the period the deadliest one in the last decade.

Among the age group of 20-29, the increase in overall mortality is dramatic with a 32% increase in overall mortality, suggesting that the vaccine is more deadly for the young than for the old.

There is a high correlation between the number of people vaccinated per day and the number of deaths per day for all age groups.






READ MORE:15 Year Old Boy Dies of Heart Attack Two Days After Taking Pfizer Vaccine, Had No History of Allergic Reactions

The risk of death after the second vaccination is higher than after the first vaccination.

In our analysis, we have found a relatively high rate of cardiac-related injuries. 26% of all cardiac events occurred in young people below the age of 40, the most common diagnosis in these cases being myocarditis or pericarditis. Additionally, a high prevalence of massive vaginal bleeding, neurological, skeletal and skin damages have been observed. A significant number of adverse events reported are related to coagulopathy (myocardial infarction, stroke, miscarriages, disruption of blood flow to the limbs, pulmonary embolism).

The reporting of adverse events has been discouraged by health authorities.

See this.

This is amazing. The Israeli public health authorities and government are participating in a “genocide” of the Israeli people.

Israel has blocked vaccinating the Palestinians because Israel doesn’t want to help the remnants of the original population of Palestine as they are in the way of Greater Israel. Consequently,

Covid deaths and cases among the unvaccinated in Palestine are low and declining, while among Israelis they are exploding. Is Israel’s Covid policy going to kill off the Israeli population?

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Dr. Paul Craig Roberts writes on his blog site, PCR Institute for Political Economy, where this article was originally published. He is a frequent contributor to Global Research.

Featured image is from National File


Related Articles


The Israeli People Committee’s April Report on the Lethal Impact of Vaccinations
The Israeli People Committee’s April Report on the Lethal Impact of Vaccinations



23 April 2021

Urgent Warning on COVID-19 Vaccine-related Deaths in the Elderly and Care Homes
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9 February 2021

COVID-19 Vaccines are Killing “Huge Numbers” of People: Government Scrubs Stats on Vaccine-Related Deaths
COVID-19 Vaccines are Killing “Huge Numbers” of People: Government Scrubs Stats on Vaccine-Related Deaths



14 August 2021


The original source of this article is Global Research

Copyright © Dr. Paul Craig Roberts, Global Research, 2021


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  • fingers
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Re: Fears and thoughts in South Africa

2 years 6 months ago
#825606

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Re: Fears and thoughts in South Africa

2 years 6 months ago
#825613
i dont understand how people can be so relaxed about a life and death issue. maybe they really like playing chicken or russian roulette . if one could poll the antivaxxers as they are wheeled into icu i bet 99 % of them would change their minds.
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  • mr hawaii
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Re: Fears and thoughts in South Africa

2 years 6 months ago
#825617
Amazing to think the USA might still be under British rule if Washington was an Anti-vaxxer

Washington eventually instituted a system where new recruits would be inoculated with smallpox immediately upon enlistment. As a result soldiers would contract the milder form of the disease at the same time that they were being outfitted with uniforms and weapons. Soldiers would consequently be completely healed, inoculated, and supplied by the time they left to join the army.

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  • Mac
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Re: Re:Fears and thoughts in South Africa

2 years 6 months ago
#825659
As of last night the USA opened-up international travel without mandatory hotel quarantine but subject to vaccinations and pretesting. The EU did the same end of last month.
Australia has a forecast date of December, they first want all 16yo+ to be vaxxed before reopening international travel.
China seemingly will be following suit. As for India and SE Asia the situation still looks a little bleak.
No forecasts for South America.
SA remains on the red list for UK.


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Re: Re:Fears and thoughts in South Africa

2 years 6 months ago
#825688
Mac, seems like the rules can be bent when required.

Of the participants in the recent US Open only 50 percent of the players men and women were jabbed.

And the crowds that numbered over 50, 000 jabbed ones on day 1 stood for over 2 hours in long queues to get in.

As for the " Agnorant " tweet from the joker in USA made in August 2020, will he have the balls to tweet how those non jabbed Tennis players could have infected the crowds?

Though subject to testing every
3 days, surely unjabbed athletes will remain just that, the status remains unchanged because of..... No Jab passports?

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